You found two of my biggest pet peeves in one person: 1. Claiming to be an expert when you're clearly not. 2. Claiming to be "ex-Mormon" when you're DEFINITELY not. They're two variants of the same problem, really; lies to present a false sense of trust and reliability.
The only thing missing (and maybe he said this, too, but you didn't write about it), is to say that "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" is our recent rebranding to seem more Christian. Nevermind that it's been THE name for nearly 200 years.
It's as though the guy has a speech full of confirmation bias offered to those who already agree with him. For as much as it bothers me that his seemingly only familiarity with the "oni" combination in written form is via "macaroni", lying about past membership is worse. I see it too often. Some people genuinely left the church and are all about new beliefs now. Others just make blanket claims about past membership that we're supposed to accept on face value but as soon as you scratch beyond the surface it's apparent that it's just a role they're playing. If you need to lie about who you are in order to feign credibility, you're just admitting we shouldn't listen to you. It's why I'd MUCH rather than people spend time on "Here's what I believe and why. Let's discuss." instead of "Here's why you're wrong and going to Hell and stuff, but I say it out of love".
I'm reminded of a video I saw not long ago. Rather, it was a video wherein these guys critiqued someone else's video and that someone else was VERY guilty of saying "muh-ROW-nee" whilst claiming past church affiliation (or at least proximity). It may well be the same guy you wrote about.
Note: growing up, PLENTY of people misread MANY words in both the Bible and the Book of Mormon. I can't tell you how many times I've heard Nephi as "Neffy". So they didn't reference the pronunciation guide, maybe never read it aloud before, I don't know. But those people don't prop themselves up as experts. Meanwhile, the names and words in the Bible I can't pronounce correctly would fill their own book. Doesn't mean I never read it. Just means I'm guilty of not learning good pronunciation.
Same. He might have framed it as re-branding (that’s quite a popular take) but I didn’t watch enough of it to know. Whenever people tell me the Church is rebranding to add Christ into the name, I can tell they don’t know the history (or they do, but they don’t care enough to consider the “re-branding” from a historical perspective).
And thanks for the share. That wasn't the same guy, but apparently it's a common mistake / temptation to inflate credentials. (There's a long and storied tradition in evangelicalism of inflating credentials, e.g., Walter Martin, Kent Hovind, Ravi Zacharias). I regret it a lot, and call it out when I can.
Right? I was being charitable in the essay. He came across like that guy who “almost joined the Navy SEALs” but got a shin splint on the way to bootcamp and was discharged. And yet, he’s experienced enough to explain the ins-and-outs of Naval Special Warfare tactics, and why he would have done it differently.
I agree that those all end in a long I sound, along with Haggai, but that sound is created by the combination of the two letters (ah-ee), with the i creating the "ee" that completes the sound, like in the word "aisle." But I totally agree that when it's a lone I at the end of the name, it creates the long I sound like in Levi, Malachi, Rabbi, etc., and fits that we pronounce it that way in Lehi, Nephi, Moroni.
I just think the "ai"-ending names don't fit with this discussion - are there even any of those in the Book of Mormon at all, or that we pronounce differently than those Bible names/words?
You found two of my biggest pet peeves in one person: 1. Claiming to be an expert when you're clearly not. 2. Claiming to be "ex-Mormon" when you're DEFINITELY not. They're two variants of the same problem, really; lies to present a false sense of trust and reliability.
The only thing missing (and maybe he said this, too, but you didn't write about it), is to say that "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" is our recent rebranding to seem more Christian. Nevermind that it's been THE name for nearly 200 years.
It's as though the guy has a speech full of confirmation bias offered to those who already agree with him. For as much as it bothers me that his seemingly only familiarity with the "oni" combination in written form is via "macaroni", lying about past membership is worse. I see it too often. Some people genuinely left the church and are all about new beliefs now. Others just make blanket claims about past membership that we're supposed to accept on face value but as soon as you scratch beyond the surface it's apparent that it's just a role they're playing. If you need to lie about who you are in order to feign credibility, you're just admitting we shouldn't listen to you. It's why I'd MUCH rather than people spend time on "Here's what I believe and why. Let's discuss." instead of "Here's why you're wrong and going to Hell and stuff, but I say it out of love".
I'm reminded of a video I saw not long ago. Rather, it was a video wherein these guys critiqued someone else's video and that someone else was VERY guilty of saying "muh-ROW-nee" whilst claiming past church affiliation (or at least proximity). It may well be the same guy you wrote about.
https://youtu.be/CpkOdydqDV4
Note: growing up, PLENTY of people misread MANY words in both the Bible and the Book of Mormon. I can't tell you how many times I've heard Nephi as "Neffy". So they didn't reference the pronunciation guide, maybe never read it aloud before, I don't know. But those people don't prop themselves up as experts. Meanwhile, the names and words in the Bible I can't pronounce correctly would fill their own book. Doesn't mean I never read it. Just means I'm guilty of not learning good pronunciation.
Same. He might have framed it as re-branding (that’s quite a popular take) but I didn’t watch enough of it to know. Whenever people tell me the Church is rebranding to add Christ into the name, I can tell they don’t know the history (or they do, but they don’t care enough to consider the “re-branding” from a historical perspective).
And thanks for the share. That wasn't the same guy, but apparently it's a common mistake / temptation to inflate credentials. (There's a long and storied tradition in evangelicalism of inflating credentials, e.g., Walter Martin, Kent Hovind, Ravi Zacharias). I regret it a lot, and call it out when I can.
Didn't expect this take. You totally nailed that 'fellow Mormans' observasion. So good!
lol that picture - and agreed, if you can’t even pronounce the names right, “expert” is not the right word.
Also, I’m sure a lot of church members wouldn’t even call themselves experts. There is so much scripture, theology, culture, and history to unpack.
Right? I was being charitable in the essay. He came across like that guy who “almost joined the Navy SEALs” but got a shin splint on the way to bootcamp and was discharged. And yet, he’s experienced enough to explain the ins-and-outs of Naval Special Warfare tactics, and why he would have done it differently.
Great minds …
Such a fascinating little resource!
My photo doesn't show?
It does on the mobile app. Substack isn't the greatest cross-platforms, I'm learning...
Yes, they are pronounced as a long I because of the a before them - a dipthong, but I'm not questioning any of the pronunciations.
I’m confused, then, by your point. Could you give an example or two?
I agree that those all end in a long I sound, along with Haggai, but that sound is created by the combination of the two letters (ah-ee), with the i creating the "ee" that completes the sound, like in the word "aisle." But I totally agree that when it's a lone I at the end of the name, it creates the long I sound like in Levi, Malachi, Rabbi, etc., and fits that we pronounce it that way in Lehi, Nephi, Moroni.
I just think the "ai"-ending names don't fit with this discussion - are there even any of those in the Book of Mormon at all, or that we pronounce differently than those Bible names/words?
Ah, I see what you’re saying. Point taken!
But the long I sound of "ai" ending is actually "ah-ee," so doesn't exactly fit with this good explanation of names ending with the letter I.
As in Ai, Malchai, Elai? These are all pronounced with long I.
Did you have a specific name in mind?