Enlightening take, so thank you! A few books further on in the Book of Mormon, a righteous king preached to his people essentially the same thing. Mosiah 2:21 reads, "I say unto you that if ye should serve him who has created you from the beginning, and is preserving you from day to day, by lending you breath, that ye may live and move and do according to your own will, and even supporting you from one moment to another—I say, if ye should serve him with all your whole souls yet ye would be unprofitable servants." There is more in the verses previous and after, as you rightly state about context. No active Latter-day Saint believe salvation is based on works. Great article, again, thank you!
Super interesting. You make a strong case against the works as prerequisite reading of this verse. I’m adopting this view of the verse. What I don’t see in this chapter is an Evangelical-style chronological first grace, second works pattern. I see a grace “and” we keep the law, and a grace “yet” we keep the law.
Ah yes, the never ending Protestant view that "no no, God doesn't really care if do anything good.... there's zero difference between the man who sleeps in on Sunday and goes fishing and the guy who is out there at the soup kitchen 3 times a week and donating his time and money to widows! God loves them both equally and will save both equally, so..... yeah, you should be the guy helping the widow, but if you are the lazy bum instead, no big deal! You are saved, brother!"
We are all in the pit, and Jesus is going around offering everyone a ladder to climb out of the pit. Can the man who gets out of the pit by climbing the ladder boast that he saved himself? Of course not. But... you gotta climb the ladder! And Protestants say that no, no one has to climb the ladder. Just accept that Jesus saves and do nothing!
Maybe that's a caricature, but every single time I have run into a Protestant minister they go all "Grace alone! No need for works, ever! You can't earn your way to Heaven and God will punish you for thinking you must do something! God doesn't care!" and I ask... Did they actually read what Jesus said or are they just following a version of Paul that Paul is horrified at? And why would God require the Law of Moses and then tell Christians, "actually, that was all a lie. All you really have to do is say a little prayer and you're good. No sacrifice needed, no nothing, just your little prayer and if you have saving faith maybe you'll mow someone's lawn once in a while. None of that messy sacrifice and keeping commandments required! yes, I hated the Jews and gave them a different way to heaven. But trust Me, God is no respecter of Persons! You get the easy way, and people before I came, well, they got the hard way!"
That’s not Protestantism you’ve described; rather, it’s what Protestants themselves call “cheap grace,” which is “the preaching of forgiveness without requiring repentance, baptism without church discipline, Communion without confession, absolution without personal confession. Cheap grace is grace without discipleship, grace without the cross, grace without Jesus Christ.” (Diedrich Bonhoeffer, Cost of Discipleship).
Yes, God absolutely cares if His people "do good," because we were "created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them" (Eph 2:10).
Here is a partial list of significant Protestants with whom the Protestants you've described are out of step (from a theology class I teach to the low-church, evangelical Protestant church where I pastor, i.e., this is what I, a Protestant pastor, tell fellow Protestants):
Martin Luther: “Oh, it is a living, busy, active, mighty thing, this faith; and so it is impossible for it not to do good works incessantly. It does not ask whether there are good works to do, but before the question rises, it has already done them, and is always at the doing of them. He who does not these works is a faithless man.”
Augsburg Confession: "Also they teach that this faith is bound to bring forth good fruits, and that it is necessary to do good works commanded by God, because of God’s will..."
Philip Melanchthon: "Nor, indeed, is this faith an idle knowledge, neither can it coexist with mortal sin, but it is a work of the Holy Ghost, whereby we are freed from death, and terrified minds are encouraged and quickened."
John Calvin: "It is therefore faith alone which justifies, and yet the faith which justifies is not alone: just as it is the heat alone of the sun which warms the earth, and yet in the sun it is not alone, because it is constantly conjoined with light."
Heidelberg Catechism: "But doth not this doctrine make men careless and profane? Answer. By no means: for it is impossible that those, who are implanted into Christ by a true faith, should not bring forth fruits of thankfulness."
Thirty-Nine Articles: "Albeit that Good Works, which are the fruits of Faith, and follow after Justification, cannot put away our sins, and endure the severity of God’s Judgement; yet are they pleasing and acceptable to God in Christ, and do spring out necessarily of a true and lively Faith; insomuch that by them a lively Faith may be as evidently known as a tree discerned by the fruit."
Formula of Concord: "First, there is no controversy among our theologians concerning the following points in this article, namely: that it is God’s will, order, and command that believers should walk in good works; and that truly good works are not those which every one contrives himself from a good intention, or which are done according to traditions of men, but those which God Himself has prescribed and commanded in His Word."
Westminster Confession of Faith: "These good works, done in obedience to God's commandments, are the fruits and evidences of a true and lively faith: and by them believers manifest their thankfulness, strengthen their assurance, edify their brethren, adorn the profession of the gospel, stop the mouths of the adversaries, and glorify God, whose workmanship they are, created in Christ Jesus thereunto, that, having their fruit unto holiness, they may have the end, eternal life."
In sum, justifying faith is the sole instrument by which a sinner lays hold of Christ's righteousness, and that this same faith inevitably produces the fruit of obedience, so that that a professed faith without holiness is no faith at all.
The position you've encountered is a caricature of Protestantism, even if it’s held by self-professing Protestants themselves. They are wrong to believe God expects no good works from His people, but it is equally wrong to believe good works is what creates God’s people.
I hope you will help to correct this caricature by refusing to perpetuate it.
Enlightening take, so thank you! A few books further on in the Book of Mormon, a righteous king preached to his people essentially the same thing. Mosiah 2:21 reads, "I say unto you that if ye should serve him who has created you from the beginning, and is preserving you from day to day, by lending you breath, that ye may live and move and do according to your own will, and even supporting you from one moment to another—I say, if ye should serve him with all your whole souls yet ye would be unprofitable servants." There is more in the verses previous and after, as you rightly state about context. No active Latter-day Saint believe salvation is based on works. Great article, again, thank you!
Thanks for reading, and for sharing those thoughts!
Super interesting. You make a strong case against the works as prerequisite reading of this verse. I’m adopting this view of the verse. What I don’t see in this chapter is an Evangelical-style chronological first grace, second works pattern. I see a grace “and” we keep the law, and a grace “yet” we keep the law.
It was points out to me that this is similar to Jared Ludlow’s interpretation:
https://rsc.byu.edu/vol-18-no-1-2017/after-all-we-can-do-2-nephi-2523
This conversation always reminds me of the phrase "just men made perfect" from D&C 129 and ideas in D&C 76:52-53.
I guess it depends on whether you believe Nephi was an actual living person or not. If not, the verse is meaningless.
Ah yes, the never ending Protestant view that "no no, God doesn't really care if do anything good.... there's zero difference between the man who sleeps in on Sunday and goes fishing and the guy who is out there at the soup kitchen 3 times a week and donating his time and money to widows! God loves them both equally and will save both equally, so..... yeah, you should be the guy helping the widow, but if you are the lazy bum instead, no big deal! You are saved, brother!"
We are all in the pit, and Jesus is going around offering everyone a ladder to climb out of the pit. Can the man who gets out of the pit by climbing the ladder boast that he saved himself? Of course not. But... you gotta climb the ladder! And Protestants say that no, no one has to climb the ladder. Just accept that Jesus saves and do nothing!
Maybe that's a caricature, but every single time I have run into a Protestant minister they go all "Grace alone! No need for works, ever! You can't earn your way to Heaven and God will punish you for thinking you must do something! God doesn't care!" and I ask... Did they actually read what Jesus said or are they just following a version of Paul that Paul is horrified at? And why would God require the Law of Moses and then tell Christians, "actually, that was all a lie. All you really have to do is say a little prayer and you're good. No sacrifice needed, no nothing, just your little prayer and if you have saving faith maybe you'll mow someone's lawn once in a while. None of that messy sacrifice and keeping commandments required! yes, I hated the Jews and gave them a different way to heaven. But trust Me, God is no respecter of Persons! You get the easy way, and people before I came, well, they got the hard way!"
They are wrong, plainly so.
That’s not Protestantism you’ve described; rather, it’s what Protestants themselves call “cheap grace,” which is “the preaching of forgiveness without requiring repentance, baptism without church discipline, Communion without confession, absolution without personal confession. Cheap grace is grace without discipleship, grace without the cross, grace without Jesus Christ.” (Diedrich Bonhoeffer, Cost of Discipleship).
Yes, God absolutely cares if His people "do good," because we were "created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them" (Eph 2:10).
Here is a partial list of significant Protestants with whom the Protestants you've described are out of step (from a theology class I teach to the low-church, evangelical Protestant church where I pastor, i.e., this is what I, a Protestant pastor, tell fellow Protestants):
Martin Luther: “Oh, it is a living, busy, active, mighty thing, this faith; and so it is impossible for it not to do good works incessantly. It does not ask whether there are good works to do, but before the question rises, it has already done them, and is always at the doing of them. He who does not these works is a faithless man.”
Augsburg Confession: "Also they teach that this faith is bound to bring forth good fruits, and that it is necessary to do good works commanded by God, because of God’s will..."
Philip Melanchthon: "Nor, indeed, is this faith an idle knowledge, neither can it coexist with mortal sin, but it is a work of the Holy Ghost, whereby we are freed from death, and terrified minds are encouraged and quickened."
John Calvin: "It is therefore faith alone which justifies, and yet the faith which justifies is not alone: just as it is the heat alone of the sun which warms the earth, and yet in the sun it is not alone, because it is constantly conjoined with light."
Heidelberg Catechism: "But doth not this doctrine make men careless and profane? Answer. By no means: for it is impossible that those, who are implanted into Christ by a true faith, should not bring forth fruits of thankfulness."
Thirty-Nine Articles: "Albeit that Good Works, which are the fruits of Faith, and follow after Justification, cannot put away our sins, and endure the severity of God’s Judgement; yet are they pleasing and acceptable to God in Christ, and do spring out necessarily of a true and lively Faith; insomuch that by them a lively Faith may be as evidently known as a tree discerned by the fruit."
Formula of Concord: "First, there is no controversy among our theologians concerning the following points in this article, namely: that it is God’s will, order, and command that believers should walk in good works; and that truly good works are not those which every one contrives himself from a good intention, or which are done according to traditions of men, but those which God Himself has prescribed and commanded in His Word."
Westminster Confession of Faith: "These good works, done in obedience to God's commandments, are the fruits and evidences of a true and lively faith: and by them believers manifest their thankfulness, strengthen their assurance, edify their brethren, adorn the profession of the gospel, stop the mouths of the adversaries, and glorify God, whose workmanship they are, created in Christ Jesus thereunto, that, having their fruit unto holiness, they may have the end, eternal life."
In sum, justifying faith is the sole instrument by which a sinner lays hold of Christ's righteousness, and that this same faith inevitably produces the fruit of obedience, so that that a professed faith without holiness is no faith at all.
The position you've encountered is a caricature of Protestantism, even if it’s held by self-professing Protestants themselves. They are wrong to believe God expects no good works from His people, but it is equally wrong to believe good works is what creates God’s people.
I hope you will help to correct this caricature by refusing to perpetuate it.